From Kade (i_kn0w_HIM@thesevenproject.com):
Sorry this doesn’t go with the statistics thing. But in response to Mitchell.
God created human beings to live with Him and worship Him, but he gave us free will so that we would be able to love. Because of free will, we don’t always choose the right thing, hence sin. Now, sin, unfortunately seperates us from God, which makes our lives miserable to an extent, whether we realize it or not, because we lack His presence in our lives. We were meant to live in His presence, if we don’t live with Him because of sin, then we’re like a fish out of water. Jesus didn’t die for our sins, He died because of our sin, because it was seperating us from God. It’s not a struggle between bad or good, or what you do, it’s a struggle of becoming to know God, and love Him, and being able to spend eternity in Heaven with Him, doing what you were created to do in eternal bliss, instead of being permanently seperated from Him and being cast our of His presence into Hell. The thing that most humans have a problem with, me included, is that we don’t want to submit to that high of an authority, and do what He wants us to do. But, we fail to realize that He is our Creator. And that’s the part of the equation that people need to realize to make the rest of it, the whole, sin, seperation, dying, salvation, bit make sense.
Every human has at one time felt a void in his or her life, something that wasn’t there, some love, or something that makes you feel alone. That is the seperation that you have from God.
Now the reason Christians view the rest of the world as ‘unsaved,’ or the ‘lost’ is because, they have not excepted God, and become a Christian, therefore, when called into Eternity, (according to Christians) they will not join in with the feasting in Heaven. They will be permantently cast into Hell, seperation from God. If any loving human being, seriously thought that that was going to happen to the rest of the world, then they would call the people who don’t realize it ‘unsaved’ as well. Not to diss any other religions, they have passion, they believe in what they’re doing more than some Christians I know. But I, being a Christian, despite their passion, still see them as the unsaved, just like they, despite my passion, still see me as ‘unsaved’(or whatever their religion says). It’s just this religion, is more than a religion to me ‘it is a relationship’ like has been said before. The relationship saves you, hence, the unsaved business.
I apologize for the rant. I really do, but I’m being rushed out of class, and I don’t have time to sort through it. Sorry, if I repeated anything. I really do respect you, and I hope that you eventually will look at Christians as something other than.
Once again, sorry for the rant.
This was left as a comment to the post “Christian Statistics” but I thought it was worth delving into here.
“God created human beings.” Ok. I never really thought of it like that before, but now it makes perfect sense. Here I was waiting around for evidence and really all I needed was you telling me. . . thank you.
“Now, sin, unfortunately seperates us from God, which makes our lives miserable to an extent, whether we realize it or not, because we lack His presence in our lives.” Maybe what’s really making you miserable is being made to feel like a worthless scumbag by a book that arbitrarily makes rules, breaks them, and then reinforces them again. Just an idea. I’m personally quite happy without the guilt.
“it’s a struggle of becoming to know God, and love Him” I can see how there might be some sort of zen in this activity, but I find that there are far more useful ways to spend my time that getting in touch with my imaginary friends.
“Every human has at one time felt a void in his or her life, something that wasn’t there, some love, or something that makes you feel alone. That is the seperation that you have from God.” Or, alternatively, maybe that’s you realizing that your relentless devotion to a buzz-kill has left you friendless and alone. Maybe you’re just depressed and need to go to a doctor. Maybe your priest abused you as a child leaving you incapable of having any real relationships. There are countless reasons you might feel unloved or alone – and chances are imaginary friends arn’t helping you with that (because by definition, they’re just keeping you alone).
“But I, being a Christian, despite their passion, still see them as the unsaved” Wow. So let us pretend for the time being that there is a god, and that there is a heaven and a hell. Let us also then say that you are right, and that that god would send a person who has never even had the opportunity; who would have no possible way of knowing about “christianity” – that he (or she, I don’t want to be gender bias when speaking of fictional entities here) would send that person to hell. The person has had no contact with christianity and so free will certainly isn’t to blame. This means that either A) your god is not all powerful becuase he can not stop an innocent man from going to hell or B) he is all powerful and can stop it but chooses not to because he’s a dick. That’s my kinda god.
“The thing that most humans have a problem with, me included, is that we don’t want to submit to that high of an authority” The thing that you seem not to realize is that you do, in fact, have a profound urge to be submissive – why else would you throw yourself on your knees and believe desperately in something so ridiculous? There is nothing, absolutely nothing in the natural world that is even remotely similar to what we call god. As humans we know things from experience only. We can think, we can infer, we can do all these things but ultimately we can only do them because we share common experience. A rock, for instance, when dropped out of your hand in Zimbabwe, will always fall to the earth and not into the sky. These observable phenomena allow us to learn everything we have about the world. And what, pray tell, have you seen that would allow you to believe in an invisible, all powerful, omnipotent being? I once thought something like that could be possible after looking at the Chinchilla, but ultimately decided against it.
Thanks for reading and taking the time to comment, I appreciate it!